Attendance Record

[Limey]

Astros set a new franchise low for MMPUS on Sunday: 14,195.  Previous low was 18k against the Reds in 2003 - they got less than that last night.

I've said it before: by the time 2013 and the AL rolls around, $70mm will be nowhere near enough.


ETA:  That's paid attendance.  I'm guessing AISes was way lower than that.

[Gizzmonic]

Yup, is it too late to go back on that one?  The money they're gonna lose in TV deals alone (playing most road games on the west coast vs. the likes of Seattle and Anaheim) seems like it should be more than $70 mil.

[Limey]

Yup, is it too late to go back on that one?  The money they're gonna lose in TV deals alone (playing most road games on the west coast vs. the likes of Seattle and Anaheim) seems like it should be more than $70.

To win back "fans", they're going to have to put a consistent winner on the field.  That will cost multiples of $70mm, which will have to be committed while still hemorrhaging money, which will never happen.

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

[Reuben]

Astros set a new franchise low for MMPUS on Sunday: 14,195.  Previous low was 18k against the Reds in 2003 - they got less than that last night.

I've said it before: by the time 2013 and the AL rolls around, $70mm will be nowhere near enough.


ETA:  That's paid attendance.  I'm guessing AISes was way lower than that.

Brownie said on the TV last night that the 14k Sunday was actual attendance, not just paid. Whether that's true or not, I can't say. The park certainly looked very empty Sun and Mon, but who can tell for sure what 14,000 looks like spread out across a 40,000+ capacity park, as opposed to, say 8 or 10,000?

The previous MMP low was 18,500 (paid) for a game in 2003. It would be pretty drastic for the new low to suddenly be over 4,000 less.

[Clark in Denver]

To win back "fans", they're going to have to put a consistent winner on the field.  That will cost multiples of $70mm, which will have to be committed while still hemorrhaging money, which will never happen.

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

All they have to do to win me back is announce they are staying in the National League. I'm not sure what that will run them.

[ValpoCory]

To win back "fans", they're going to have to put a consistent winner on the field.  That will cost multiples of $70mm, which will have to be committed while still hemorrhaging money, which will never happen.

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

Maybe you were being hyperbolic, and maybe it's the optimist in me, but I think the Astros will be popular again without leaving town. 

[JimR]

To win back "fans", they're going to have to put a consistent winner on the field.  That will cost multiples of $70mm, which will have to be committed while still hemorrhaging money, which will never happen.

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

good grief.

[BizidyDizidy]

I think you are all grossly overestimating the financial harm of the AL move. That is not why the stands are empty - people just don't care. The 70MM could easily be 100% gravy.

[roadrunner]

Brownie said on the TV last night that the 14k Sunday was actual attendance, not just paid. Whether that's true or not, I can't say. The park certainly looked very empty Sun and Mon, but who can tell for sure what 14,000 looks like spread out across a 40,000+ capacity park, as opposed to, say 8 or 10,000?

The previous MMP low was 18,500 (paid) for a game in 2003. It would be pretty drastic for the new low to suddenly be over 4,000 less.

Yeah they are reporting asses in seats this year, not paid attendance which has been reported in the past.  JD said there were 20k paid for Sunday's game.  

[Ron Brand]

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

Thanks, Mr. Sunshine.

[Gizzmonic]

I think you are all grossly overestimating the financial harm of the AL move. That is not why the stands are empty - people just don't care. The 70MM could easily be 100% gravy.

You don't think moving out of a division and a league where fans actually show up (Cubs, Cards, Brewers, Braves, Mets, etc) to the 2-team Yankee/Red Sox league is gonna make a difference in gate receipts?  If you think it's bad this year, wait till next.  I guarantee they will feel the pain at the box office.

[EasTexAstro]

The road back to popularity for this franchise, unfortunately, is to follow the Oilers' blueprint, leave town and start afresh.

So, we would have a Texas team in the AL West to root for?

[roadrunner]

I think you are all grossly overestimating the financial harm of the AL move. That is not why the stands are empty - people just don't care. The 70MM could easily be 100% gravy.

I'm pretty sure the Yankees and Red Sox will bring in more than the Braves did last night, and the Braves have historically been the best draw in Houston (other than the Cubs).

My guess is that the AL move won't affect attendance much.  Winning is the only thing that will do that.  Levine's Q&A with Crane was interesting when he asked where the extra $70M went with the move.  Crane said the ownership group used that money to wash away much of the debt.

[roadrunner]

You don't think moving out of a division and a league where fans actually show up (Cubs, Cards, Brewers, Braves, Mets, etc) to the 2-team Yankee/Red Sox league is gonna make a difference in gate receipts?  If you think it's bad this year, wait till next.  I guarantee they will feel the pain at the box office.

I think that gets made up with the "new" AL teams coming in.  Houston is full of transplants, many of whom I know personally are excited to see their team play in Minute Maid every year.  Plus we'll get bandwagon Strangers fans more next year.  God, this is going to suck.

[Limey]

I'm pretty sure the Yankees and Red Sox will bring in more than the Braves did last night, and the Braves have historically been the best draw in Houston (other than the Cubs).

My guess is that the AL move won't affect attendance much.  Winning is the only thing that will do that.  Levine's Q&A with Crane was interesting when he asked where the extra $70M went with the move.  Crane said the ownership group used that money to wash away much of the debt.

The debt washed away wasn't the club's debt prior to the purchase, it was the debt run up by Crane's syndicate in order to acquire the club.  I.e., the $70mm is already gone and now they're operating on much-reduced revenues - not just in gate receipts but in merchandise and concession sales.  Servicing the remaining debt will swallow up an unknown portion of the operating revenues, and the club has been clear about its need to slash player payroll.

Some of you think my earlier statement was hyperbolic.  That's fine.  I do hope I'm wrong.  But businesses don't come back from downward spirals like this without a major injection of capital, which isn't coming, and/or a change in ownership, which has already happened.

[Limey]

I think that gets made up with the "new" AL teams coming in.  Houston is full of transplants, many of whom I know personally are excited to see their team play in Minute Maid every year.  Plus we'll get bandwagon Strangers fans more next year.  God, this is going to suck.

So you think that a few games a year against the Yankees and Red Sox, plus a secret army of Seattle, Oakland and LA transplants, are going to offset the games against the Jakes, FTCs and Bravos?  The games against the Rangers will be well attended...by Rangers fans.

[BudGirl]

So you think that a few games a year against the Yankees and Red Sox, plus a secret army of Seattle, Oakland and LA transplants, are going to offset the games against the Jakes, FTCs and Bravos?  The games against the Rangers will be well attended...by Rangers fans.

The Bravos aren't exactly raking fans in this week.

I agree that the loss of playing the Cards and Cubs will hurt more than MLB would admit. 

And opposing fans at MMP is something some of us are already numb to.

[Gizzmonic]

So you think that a few games a year against the Yankees and Red Sox, plus a secret army of Seattle, Oakland and LA transplants, are going to offset the games against the Jakes, FTCs and Bravos?  The games against the Rangers will be well attended...by Rangers fans.

Yup.  Someone posted a list of the worst road draws in MLB here not too long ago.  Most of 'em are in the AL, and I believe Anaheim, Seattle and Oakland are all in the bottom five.  I'll repeat it: the AL has 2 teams that draw well on the road, and they are not in the Astros' division.  On the same token, the Astros are not likely to help attendance for AL West teams except for the Rangers.  Colorado or Arizona would have been a much better fit.

[roadrunner]

The debt washed away wasn't the club's debt prior to the purchase, it was the debt run up by Crane's syndicate in order to acquire the club.  I.e., the $70mm is already gone and now they're operating on much-reduced revenues - not just in gate receipts but in merchandise and concession sales.  Servicing the remaining debt will swallow up an unknown portion of the operating revenues, and the club has been clear about its need to slash player payroll.

Some of you think my earlier statement was hyperbolic.  That's fine.  I do hope I'm wrong.  But businesses don't come back from downward spirals like this without a major injection of capital, which isn't coming, and/or a change in ownership, which has already happened.

What about the big TV deal about to kick in?

[Limey]

Yup.  Someone posted a list of the worst road draws in MLB here not too long ago.  Most of 'em are in the AL, and I believe Anaheim, Seattle and Oakland are all in the bottom five.  I'll repeat it: the AL has 2 teams that draw well on the road, and they are not in the Astros' division.  On the same token, the Astros are not likely help attendance for AL West teams except for the Rangers.  Colorado or Arizona would have been a much better fit.

The Astros will join the west coast AL West teams at the bottom of that list.